[quote author=RottKing link=topic=515.msg4957#msg4957 date=1318312322]...[/quote]<br /><br />Do you guys see what we&#039;re missing.<br /><br />[quote author=Gilgamesh link=topic=515.msg4969#msg4969 date=1318368340]Okay so after Ralph making some pretty good points about keeping the teams with consistent names...[/quote]<br />[quote author=Ralphis link=topic=515.msg4951#msg4951 date=1318292523]welp, idl ruined[/quote]<br /> ???<br /><br />[hr]<br /><br />So, [b]I am in favor of captains naming their own teams[/b].&nbsp; I am the one who brought it to the board after hearing several people express an interest in it.&nbsp; Here are some of the opposing arguments I encountered:<br /><br />[quote]The names will be lame.[/quote]<br /><br />First, RottKing just showed that that isn&#039;t categorically true.&nbsp; More importantly, the fact that Bones or I don&#039;t find something funny isn&#039;t a reason why four other people shouldn&#039;t be able to use it to name their team.&nbsp; I&#039;m not under the illusion that I&#039;m funnier than everyone else in IDL or more capable of coming up with hilarious and relevant names. (Although SR49ers is mine!)<br /><br />[quote]The names will be inappropriate or make the league look unprofessional.[/quote]<br /><br />The league is un(not)professional, but the concern is that somebody will advertise IDL on esreality and have to talk about the Pussy Fuckers winning the Master Bowl.&nbsp; For just this reason [b]I am in favor of administration censorship of names[/b], but I think captains can be trusted to keep it fairly tame if we ask them to.&nbsp; Honestly, I think The Puke Squad is fine.&nbsp; On the other hand, it&#039;s a video game league.&nbsp; We pretend like we want the draft show to be PG-13, and then we invite Beast.&nbsp; Online content not rated by the ESRB.<br /><br />As far as making this look like a &quot;real gaming league,&quot; real gaming league teams name themselves.&nbsp; The difference is that doom players are hilarious and CoD players (or whoever) are super e-penis and name themselves things like Hallowed Rogue and Viper Snipers, which frankly gay me out more than any previous do-it-yourself IDL names.<br /><br />[quote author=anonymous]I wouldn&#039;t cap again if I couldn&#039;t have my team named Sexual Panthers.[/quote]<br /><br />Here&#039;s the beauty of the suggestion: [i]nobody has to change their team name[/i].&nbsp; If you&#039;re a Super Chargers man and you love the name Super Chargers, then name your team the Super Chargers and go kick ass.&nbsp; &quot;But my NFL-themed team name isn&#039;t cool unless [i]all the other teams have to have NFL-themed team names[/i].&quot;&nbsp; But really?&nbsp; Is that worth forcing everybody else to use an NFL-themed team name?<br /><br />[quote]You can&#039;t compare Jenova BSK with Clim BSK.[/quote]<br /><br />Rofl.&nbsp; Nobody has ever done this, and nobody ever would.&nbsp; The reason why, of course, is because Jenova BSK and Clim BSK have nothing at all in common [i]except that they have the same team name[/i] (and the same division).&nbsp; No statistic about a relationship between the two would be interesting unless it spoke about the division and its rivals, and no statistic could be done where they have the same name that couldn&#039;t be done where they have different names.&nbsp; And they should have different names because they are different teams.<br /><br />HOWEVER, and this is relevant to the quotes above and below, [b]I believe captains should have to stick with their team names throughout the duration of their captaincy[/b].&nbsp; I might maintain this even if they stop captaining and return a few seasons later.&nbsp; In this case there is some identity to the team, it is that team whose record determines its draft spot next year, and it is statistics about that team that shows a captain&#039;s performance over time.<br /><br />[quote author=anonymous]The site won&#039;t have icons anymore. / I would have to re-do all the icons.[/quote]<br /><br />First of all, I love the icons.&nbsp; I think they are awesome.&nbsp; The site currently doesn&#039;t have icons on it except on game statistics pages, and I don&#039;t think that would be a huge loss.&nbsp; Apparently Xen has been working on a site for like a year that shows the icons on the front page.&nbsp; Lots of IDL players have graphic design competencies and can help one another out.&nbsp; I said that if it came down to it, I would make logos for the new teams.<br /><br />This is maybe the only legitimate argument in this list.&nbsp; But it&#039;s such a such a non-issue, I can&#039;t believe it would determine the outcome.<br /><br />[quote]This issue isn&#039;t important.&nbsp; Focus on other things.[/quote]<br /><br />This is a bad argument.&nbsp; Talking about team names is not [i]preventing[/i] us from getting anything accomplished.&nbsp; Whenever we bring up change, many players chant &quot;leave it,&quot; so it&#039;s not clear what issues you think we should be focusing on other than &quot;get more players.&quot;&nbsp; Indeed we have accomplished many things, which I will shortly announce, and other than finalizing the wad are more or less done with our preparation for the next season until it comes time to assign captains and so on.&nbsp; So the latter sentence is irrelevant to this discussion.&nbsp; We are focusing on other things.&nbsp; But this is about this.<br /><br />As to it not being an important issue, it looks pretty hot to me.&nbsp; There was a lot of discussion on the topic in just a few days, and the overall turnout at the polls was to me astounding.&nbsp; I don&#039;t recall seeing a poll with 39 unique results in a recent IDL thread.&nbsp; Only 72% as many people voted on which contest maps would win.&nbsp; This looks like a pretty important topic with everyone being as opinionated as they are.<br /><br />[quote]It doesn&#039;t matter what the players want.[/quote]<br /><br />In addition to it being important, it looks to me like an overwhelming number of players voted for captains naming their own teams.&nbsp; I think it would be even more significant if options 2 and 3 weren&#039;t finely parsed like they are (were one option), and even more significant if it were between 1 and 4.<br /><br />The above is literally the comeback of 3 or 4 administrators whenever I point out this poll.&nbsp; It&#039;s not what they want but what is best for IDL; it&#039;s up to us and not them; etc.&nbsp; I have an interesting belief: I think that in general (and in this case in particular), giving players what they want is what&#039;s best for IDL.&nbsp; If an overwhelming number of players wanted this to be a 4v4 league, I would suggest making it a 4v4 league.&nbsp; (I think they don&#039;t.)&nbsp; If player retention and player growth are the most important things for us to achieve, I can&#039;t imagine a more effective way of accomplishing these than making this the sort of league that players want to play in.<br /><br />This is basically how I feel:<br />[quote author=LordBritish link=topic=515.msg4973#msg4973 date=1318388216]I&#039;m pretty sure this is a case of everyone taking themselves way too seriously.&nbsp; I for one laugh hard every time I see &quot;Lords of Nigeria&quot; (though ID Clippers was good too).&nbsp; I dunno, I mostly play for fun now, so let&#039;s just have fun![/quote]<br /><br />My main argument in favor of my view is that it is fun.&nbsp; As a result of this, I think it will make more players want to play, (what&#039;s more likely and important) more players want to captain, and more players and non-players interested in and excited about the goings-on of a freer, funnier, funner league.